Why don't they invent the hour, minute and second while they are on the roll? Their writing is just awful. You can parody it in your mind w.o any comedic training.
Band on the Run
JoinedPosts by Band on the Run
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54
The demons are sex perverts according to the March 15th WT
by life is to short inok i finished listening to the stupid wt today while driving to work.
i got so mad listening that i truly cannot do it while i drive.
it is worse then talking on a cell phone as it just makes my blood boil.. the study article on page 24 and 25 is talking about satan and the demons.
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Christian DOCTRINE comes from WHERE exactly??
by Terry inthe great russian composer igor stravinsky is purported to have observed: "there is no such thing as music theory all though one can be derived from the existing ouvre.".
or, to put it another way: doctrine (music or scripture) is an artificial human construct and a derivative.
it is a construction of the mind based on what is already there in the work itself.. .
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Band on the Run
I wonder why they did not archive the writings. One would believe Paul's writings might have quasi-relic status in the churches he founded. I'm still not clear in how his version encompassed the other writings.
A related thought is that the doctrine is so unclear. If this were truly scripture in capital letters, Jesus could have addressed Christology better. He seems coy to me on whether he had any recognition or messianic consciousness. I don't need the Bible to be perfect. For me, I accept that I am part of a tradition. When I was a Witness, if I did not like a verse, I felt damned. Now I am quite vocal about not liking some incidents in Jesus' ministries. One example is when he almost did not heal a woman b/c she was not Jewish. I accept that something deeper is running through the scriptures. Maybe just a collective grope towards God.
I can't believe that God, the big God, creator, would truly care about the minute detail stuff. He has bigger things to do, things that I cannot comprehend as a human. Jesus is sketchy and very radical in the gospels. Does he truly care about oral sex, beards, colored shirts, music (he might be a Beatles fan since I am). We project onto Jesus what we want to see. He is much more complex. Frankly, I don't know if I truly love the scriptural Jesus. I am smitten with a figment of my mind I call Jesus. He is perfect in every way, not perfect as in complete. My Jesus is a Royal Shakesperean actor, has blue eyes, loves everyone in a groovy way, reads classical literature. Most of all he has sparkly eyes that no one else on earth has. He must have gravitas, a dignified sense of presence. I love C.S. Lewis. Liam Neeson as Aslan is great. The film before he a teenage stuffed toy as Aslan. Not good.
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Paul, leading authority on Christianity, does NOT quote Jesus!
by Terry inpaul's letters practically invent christianity.. the gospels trickled in after him.. paul never walked with jesus and yet explains him.. never a quote from the master at all.. yet, paul is such a maven.. if jesus couldn't be bothered to actually reveal what he was all about to his apostles with whom he ate, drank, spoke and slept---why this persecutor, saul?.
the apostles heard every word jesus spoke and were willing to die for him.. paul didn't--yet--miraculously explained every detail of the entire history of god's purpose including his messiah.. .
can anybody provide a non-gimmick answer?.
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Band on the Run
I can't see leaving the WT and going to all the bother only to embrace religious thinking that sounds so much like the Witnesses. Everyone can spiin the Bible in Western society. Other people don't need to be corrected with condescension. Just my personal view.
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Help: Re: Letter to elders NOT to disfellowship otherwise legal action will be taken
by LouBelle inhello there everyone.
i remember reading a while back about someone on here ( i think) that wrote a letter to the body of elders & headoffice that they should not take any action to disfellowship them as they would be distancing them from friends and relatives and would proceed to take legal action if the body of elders went ahead.. if anyone has that link or can point me in the right direction i'd appreciate that..
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Band on the Run
LouBelle,
If you are chasting me for not reading your profile, it is arrogant to assume that in a casual forum people will bother to research you. As much as I hate the Witnesses, I would step up and defend them from threat of legal action. Once you threaten, can you go to court and not be fined for filing a frivolous law suit. My entire life I've revered First Amendment rights b/c my family went through hell as Witnesses in Rutherford's time. My mom's dream was to be a teacher or a fashion designer. She was expelled for not saluting the flag, and left education when she was 14. My uncle had the highest academic score in the state of New Jersey, he was expelled with less than a week to go before graduation. Another uncle went to federal prison because of refusing to be drafted. My father was a bodyguard to Knorr and Rutherford. A right wing priest with a radioo show stirred up so much animosity towards the Witnesses that his followers forced their way into a convention at Madison Square Garden and threw ammonia bombs on women and children.
Certain principles are so important they are constitutional and outrank other legal theories. One never knows all the details of a given situation. I'm not giving legal advice but, rather, legal information. People assume the law will support their positions b/c it is a matter of common sense or virtue. I believed that fervently. There is only way for you to assess the situation. Make an appt for a consultation and discuss the merits and flaws of your particular situation. My larger point is that law is not a panacea. General discussions may be instructive but a trained professional can tailor a response based on all the relevant facts.
Your family situation is very moving. I hope you find a good resolution.
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Palin explain Sputnik Moment
by bohm inhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flom6idv94c.
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palin explain recent world history..
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Band on the Run
She frightens me mightily. I believe she led many Republicans to vote for Obama. John McCain was ancient and acted like it. Sarah Palin was supposed to bring youth and women to the ticket. He proved to all that he could not exercise sound judgment. I lived in NYC so I could go to Coney Island with binocoulars and voila I am an expert on Europe and Africa.
I am progressive. Attending certain history and political events, I mix with Republican conservatives who have heft and thoughtfulness. She is a supreme example of the dumbing down of America. I feel she has no sincerity. It is all about poll numbers and ambition. What scares me is that neutral groups have researched Dems and GOPS knowledge of objective facts. GOPs do not perform well. They are misinformed. FOX news insulates their beliefs even more. Talk radio confirms their world view.
The scary part is that people take her serously. Stranger things have happened. Her arrogance about newspapers, etc. is amazing. She is looney bin time. William F. Buckley and Irving Kristol are not looney bin people. Her job is to inflame situations.
I never viewed George W. Bush as stupid. Rather, I thought he had image problems but was sly as a fox. With Palin, I believe she is not well educated at all. Minimally educated would be an apt description. She, too, is a sly as a fox. On the other hand, she may be the best answer to Dems prayers.
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Palin explain Sputnik Moment
by bohm inhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flom6idv94c.
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palin explain recent world history..
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Band on the Run
She frightens me mightily. I believe she led many Republicans to vote for Obama. John McCain was ancient and acted like it. Sarah Palin was supposed to bring youth and women to the ticket. He proved to all that he could not exercise sound judgment. I lived in NYC so I could go to Coney Island with binocoulars and voila I am an expert on Europe and Africa.
I am progressive. Attending certain history and political events, I mix with Republican conservatives who have heft and thoughtfulness. She is a supreme example of the dumbing down of America. I feel she has no sincerity. It is all about poll numbers and ambition. What scares me is that neutral groups have researched Dems and GOPS knowledge of objective facts. GOPs do not perform well. They are misinformed. FOX news insulates their beliefs even more. Talk radio confirms their world view.
The scary part is that people take her serously. Stranger things have happened. Her arrogance about newspapers, etc. is amazing. She is looney bin time. William F. Buckley and Irving Kristol are not looney bin people. Her job is to inflame situations.
I never viewed George W. Bush as stupid. Rather, I thought he had image problems but was sly as a fox. With Palin, I believe she is not well educated at all. Minimally educated would be an apt description. She, too, is a sly as a fox. On the other hand, she may be the best answer to Dems prayers.
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54
The demons are sex perverts according to the March 15th WT
by life is to short inok i finished listening to the stupid wt today while driving to work.
i got so mad listening that i truly cannot do it while i drive.
it is worse then talking on a cell phone as it just makes my blood boil.. the study article on page 24 and 25 is talking about satan and the demons.
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Band on the Run
I am so terrified of demons. My rational mind always dismissed them but my fears were amplified. I did not sleep nights, patrolling the room for the onslaught. I was so young but the Society amped up the demon stories. The final one that clinched it for me b/c it was so over the top, like True Confessions, was the story of a demon materializing in a woman's bed. Only prayer saved her from being ravished.
Even today I fear schizopphenics because of the internal voices. I read about the illness. Indeed, I even know a few people with the disease. They aren't demonic at all. If demons are spirit, why would they lust after earth women? Out of all creation, doesn't some other planet have hot women for them to ravish?
I feel the WTS is self-selecting. The overall culture views God as a very powerful force and a god to be respected. Particularly since Christianity and even within most of Judaism, He/She is a god of love and grace. All the blood thirstiness repels people. Armageddon is so not Jesus if taken literally without any idea of its history. It also strikes me that many Psalms have such beautiful language of love, peace, and beautiful worship and then within the same verse reverse to KILL, KILl,KILL. For my own view, the Jehovah preached by the Witnesses is the true Satan.
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204
Paul, leading authority on Christianity, does NOT quote Jesus!
by Terry inpaul's letters practically invent christianity.. the gospels trickled in after him.. paul never walked with jesus and yet explains him.. never a quote from the master at all.. yet, paul is such a maven.. if jesus couldn't be bothered to actually reveal what he was all about to his apostles with whom he ate, drank, spoke and slept---why this persecutor, saul?.
the apostles heard every word jesus spoke and were willing to die for him.. paul didn't--yet--miraculously explained every detail of the entire history of god's purpose including his messiah.. .
can anybody provide a non-gimmick answer?.
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Band on the Run
I just recalled something. One of my favorite books of all time and certainly deal with religion is Katzenzakis, The Last Temptation Christ, which Martin Scorcese directed and starred Wilhelm Defoe as Jesus. The book which many churches ban is clearly fiction. He emphasizes the humanity of Christ. In the account, he has Jesus have a psychotic episode during the crucifixion just before his death. Jesus is assured by a young girl angel that God will not require the sacrifice since Jesus proved he was willing. Jesus walks away and has a marriage to Mary Magdalene. She died in childbirth I think. He moves on to Mary, sister of Lazarus. They have children. He does his carpentry. Late in life, he overhears a stranger talking about how Jesus of Nazareth died on the cross. He is very upset about this fabrication and pulls the stranger to him. He yells that what he is saying is not true. Somehow we find out this person is Paul. They don't recognize each other. Jesus is stunned that people are hearing this version of the story. Paul asserts he has preached it across the world and will continue to do so. Paul tells him it doesn't matter whether he died or not. He will preach the gospel of the crucified Jesus b/c the world needs it.
I am too lazy to reread it right now to keep all the details. It is a moving vignette. Jesus realizes that He was meant to die and prays to God to change the result. He comes out of his hallucination on the cross, fully aware of what his life could have been, and dies triumphantly. Aside from religious themes, it is one of the best written books I have encountered. Anyone interested in the historical Jesus should be better informed by this novel.
The book is not written in a sacrilegous tone. Neither is the film. Katzenzakis does not say the hallucination events ever occurred in real life but Jesus was human and the sheer pain and agony of Roman crucifizion would cause mental aberration.
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"Apostates main topic is always Disfellowshipping! And I agree with the arrangement 100%"
by sabastious inthere are a lot of witnesses that have examined the df'ing arrangement and deem it worthy to be the main force of discipline for god's earthly organization.
the prodfers as i just named them, are advovates of the policy and believe that it churns out, once the offender returns through the system in place, very "spiritual" people.. think about this process and figure out what the desired result the originator of the policy was:.
the subject is acused of a "high end sin" (requires the quantification of sin).if subject has been viewed by two or more witnesses a private hearing is formed with a panel of three elders.the subject is interogated by the panel of elders and information is gathered using policies from a secret elder handbook.
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Band on the Run
I don't understand part of it. They have no power over anyone unless you cooperate. Do they give an explanation why the hearing cannot be taped or videotaped? I'd like to hear how they rationalize it. I would think they would want a recording to protect themselves. What if one were to get in touch with everyone at the KH and explain the situation. The elder's manual being secret is another sign that the process is fundamentally unfair. Besides with the internet, how can they control this information.
The govt. can't have secret regulations. Of course, the larger question may be why anyone would agree to these ground rules.
I was able to just not go anymore without anyone traipsing after me. They could have found me. It is very uncool that people have different standards applied to them. My family still love me and associated with me. If I had been dfship, it may have been a very different story. The difference would have been tangible.
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Help: Re: Letter to elders NOT to disfellowship otherwise legal action will be taken
by LouBelle inhello there everyone.
i remember reading a while back about someone on here ( i think) that wrote a letter to the body of elders & headoffice that they should not take any action to disfellowship them as they would be distancing them from friends and relatives and would proceed to take legal action if the body of elders went ahead.. if anyone has that link or can point me in the right direction i'd appreciate that..
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Band on the Run
This topic has me hyped up. I just can't imagine why you would not want to d'f'd if you no longer believe. Perhaps my thinking is too black and white. Growing up I constantly fear rejection from extended family for not being good enough. If you do the KH thing, there is always pioneering, then Gilead or Bethel. It is endless. My immediate family faded. We had few social ties so they knew nothing of our business. A brother did knock on my mom's door all alone. He screamed out "Do you love me?". Even my JW grandmother thought that was too much. It is a bad witness to the neighbors - the fact that some numbnskull visits without permission is a ok with her. I lived to please the brothers in any way I could. When the KH was built, I sanded to perfection. Anything to get approval. School gave me approval.
As I grew older, I volunteered for college scholarships and school became more intense. Gradually, I grew out of the circle. It was gradual.
My extended family did not stop talking to us, lending us money or being loving. This result was a major shock to me. I don't want to sound snippety. The joy of being out is so divine. I despised Paul most of all. Now I'm a fan.
Legal letters don't work magic. Some may be scared. I don't see where talking to them as an equal adult or an adult condescending to them would not reach a better result. When I worked for a large firm, everyone sues. They don't take it personally. It is just a cost of business. They have in-house and outside counsel. Individuals who are not repeat players in the system are traumatized and furious.